SawzAll

Today I got sparked runners in one of the "anniversary day" gifts, and on the relic portal I've gotten 2 legendary ascension relics already, so this is also a good drop at least in my opinion. Thanks @Alexander for the portal (assuming it was your doing).

As much as you can, at least in my opinion. I've gotten 2 legendary relics already.

I understand, but let's not forget these are virtual items in a game. They don't have feelings. It's more that I don't consider it necessary. It's that I disagree with the level of urgency some are attaching to it. And because I suspect the most recent buff didn't equalize Naga and the two vests, but instead made the vests slightly overpowered. But I guess we'll see when the new META comes out.

Ah, my apologies then, I didn't connect the dots at first. @Mechzilla my apologies. However, my point that not every weapon can break into rank 1, nor could the game ever sustain a system where literally every weapon could make it into rank 1 (again, old-school Neopets). To do that would require making all weapons more or less the same, and the closer all the weapons come to being almost equal, the less appealing the game will become. Philosophically, it's a balance. That's why the "when everyone's super, no one will be" quote is more or less true.

But it demonstrates that you will insult people when you feel like they aren't doing what you want, which sort of undermines your argument. I am in touch with the people on the wiki page and WU, a lot more than you know. But I also don't think I should share what level of involvement I have with both of them because I don't think you deserve to know. Regardless, SM is changing hands. Alexander used to be at Tactisoft but decided to form a company (Gato Games) and buy SM off of Tactisoft. From what I have read and watched, Alexander did that because he cares about SM and wants to fix it. Gato Games also owns several other games now, and Alexander is a busy person. If you insult them because they aren't moving as fast as you want, you're biting the hand that feeds. I say be patient: Alexander has already shown promise, and has already done good things.

So because LG uses it, it's in the top 10, so that sort of weakens your argument. There's no reason Archimonde should be equal to monkeys and vests, that I know of. The problem is you and I are not rank 1, so we can't know if Archimonde is being used in rank 1 battles. But you can ask CleverName: he has an "ask me anything" thread elsewhere. META is the most effective tactics available, so pointing to the META isn't really a good or conclusive argument. You can to into WU and take the same META configs (which aren't intended to be cookie cutter configs or cook book types that I know of) and try stacking (for example) a Naga torso with enough platinum plates to make it more or less equal in stats to other meta configs and then battle them out and see that often some of the top torsos aren't really the "only" possibility. I think it's more that most players aren't going to have 8 platinum plates lying around. When you start to see that sometimes it's really who goes first, rather than who has the perfect META mech, by simulating things in WU, you start to see what I mean. And given that buffs can become a vicious circle, that's why I'm saying I don't see how a buff to Archimonde is necessary. But feel free to disagree with me.

But that logic has no end and results in a vicious circle of buffs. Where will it end? What next? "I don't see people using Arnold in R1 so it needs to become a R-M weapon and it needs a buff." That's the main problem I have with that logic: there's no end to it, and it's going to result in a lot of forum thrash because people are going to create "Buff _____" threads constantly. Not every weapon can be the best and not every weapon will make it into rank 1. It's simply not possible unless you pull a Neopets and start making all the weapons more or less equal, just with different looks. And given that I played Neopets in like 2001 or something way long ago, trust me, you don't want that type of system. It is normal for the top dogs of any competitive system to have that 1% difference that makes them better than other types. META is the "most effective tactics available." Thus Desolation isn't the problem and doesn't need a buff. Not every weapon will work harmoniously with other weapons. And besides, unless you are rank 1, you can't know if there's rank 1 battles going on with Desolation. You can watch rank 1 player replays forever, but usually SM only shows you the top 10 players (which is not all of rank 1), so you're not seeing all the rank 1 battles. It would be best, in fact, to ask some rank 1 people like CleverName if they've seen desolation in rank 1. He has an "ask me anything" thread elsewhere on this forum.

Third max mythical monkey torso, this one for my physical mech.

Well, just to be clear, SM isn't about being ultra-realistic. For example, 1000 kg is the weight of a Mazda Miata, last I checked. I think it sort of makes sense, but it's not ultra-realistic.

This sounds like something from Team Fortress 2 where you can smelt and craft items. I would not be against it, if it's a way for players to obtain premium L-M items. But it would need to be very controlled and researched because there are two things you want to avoid. First, you want to avoid making it too easy to get premiums because that would make premiums less premium. The current SM business model seems to be paying for premium items, and so the conversation is bigger than just the players: it's their business model. I'm not against the way their current business model is, I'm just saying if we cut into their profit, we may accidentally kill the game. Second, you want to avoid making it too difficult to get premiums because that would cause some players to be discouraged. I have no clue, but just a quick idea off the top of my head, i would think four divine malice beams would convert to one legendary (1) valiant sniper. Does anyone have any other ideas about the exchange rate? Honestly, I played TF2 for years, but i hated their crafting system. It took too much effort to get the items I wanted. I ended up buying a couple cosmetics I liked (but I spent maybe $10 total for two complete cosmetic kits).

We could just ask Alexander............

It's interesting but I don't think it's really needed.

I'm not really into shields. And technically they asked us to attach polls to Meta discussions. I think the easier solution, if they wanted to buff energy, is to simply buff damage and energy drain and such. But seeing as there is an energy player in the top 10, I can't say energy is in such a bad state that it needs rescuing. More that it would be a nice thing to do, perhaps, if done properly. Still, I would be against another round of buffs, as the last one didn't go so well in my opinion. So yeah, I'm not for shields, but not against.

It seems to me that a lot of what is on the META thread is people who aren't in the top ranks arguing over which of their favorite items or weapons need a buff. I don't think this is very useful to the forum or to Alexander (but it's his life, he decides what is useful). Several people have commented that only the top ranks understand the META. I find that assertion both illogical and intellectually repugnant. But if that's true, then let's fix it: I recommend that the fix may be to lock out this area of the forum to only those who are rank 1-5 who are validated by email address. Invite only if necessary. That way everyone who complains that people's opinions aren't valid (who are also usually not rank 1-5 themselves) have less to complain about. I am not being a jerk when I write this. I'm just saying IF that's true, then why not fix it? If only ranks 1-5 understand the mystical META, then why not lock this area to ranks 1-5? If instead people who say that only ranks 1-5 understand the META are incorrect, please reply and tell me I'm wrong. Teach me something.

@CleverName hey I noticed recently it looked like you were testing a heat hugger using molten platinum vest. Is that what you were doing? How did it go? And do you think that configuration will become META ?

Thanks. I don't have any legendary relics yet. I should've probably said so.

I wouldn't use cracked plasma cannon for close range. It's got backfire. I'm only arena rank 10/11 but in this case, I would say magma recoiler and/or a hammer. But is it because you're trying to go light weight in order to add the iron platings? Because I can see this not going as well because the repulsor, while it's a cool weapon, is like losing a turn to push the enemy away: you didn't do much damage or heat. And cracked plasma cannon is not energy free, so trying to go energy free with this config may not work out. If my energy mech drains you at range 1-3 (which it can because Storm Weaver and Last Words), you may have to use turns jumping away to use your desolations. And if I see you're a dual desolation build, that will probably be my goal is to get you out of desolation range. The charge doesn't make sense if your goal is to stay at range 4-8 for desolations. I would recommend a teleporter instead. Just my random mid-level thoughts. I'm not an expert, I just have ideas. For this mech, if I was facing you in the arena, terror blade would scare me more, actually, because it deals good heat damage. But you'd have to follow that with some sort of 2-4 push weapon, and there's no last words version for heat. In the past, I've used terror cry to push people away, but you may want more than 1 push, so for 2 push there's magma recoiler.

I agree here. IF there was a torso I would be willing to buff (which there probably isn't, given how people are behaving) it would be HSA, and only to make it equal to the other monkey torsos. And that's due to game philosophy, not META or any specific need. Note in CleverName's META there aren't any HSAs.

It's unachievable for anyone who isn't rich or incredibly lucky. But I test out my builds, and talk to others and get advice from other players. I'm not the expert, and I really don't care to ever become the expert either. But what I was saying about maybe not understanding it is called academic humility: I acknowledge that I am only one person, and I can't know everything. But I can definitely go and test it out in WU. I appreciate you sharing about the META, and teaching me some stuff.

Not really. It's serving the community by preventing this from turning into "if you complain enough, long enough, loud enough, eventually you'll get what you want." When you realize, as you gain rank, that Archimonde, or in my case, Grim Reaper, is not the best torso, you can either ignore that and buff your Archimonde and complain in the forum until they buff it. Or you can switch to a better torso and stop wasting upgrade time and resources on it. Now there are other options than just the monkey torsos. Game META doesn't necessarily need to evolve, nor does it only evolve by buffing weaker torsos. It can also evolve with new items, so your assertion that the "only" way META can evolve is by buffing other torsos is not really true. The goal of SM was never "either you have monkey torso or you lose." I lose to people with all kinds of torsos at arena rank 10/11. And now the Lightning Platinum Vest and Windigo are viable. Last I checked, CleverName was busy testing a heat hugger config with Molten Platinum Vest. (That may have changed by now.) Archimonde is still useful, so I don't see this as "not being useful." I compare it to sports cars. Can all sports cars be an SSC Tuatara and have the top land speed record of 316? Should trucks and vans be upgraded so they can post the same land speed record numbers? Of course not. The Tuatara is probably engineered for straight line speed. This is why, in road races, BMWs and cars with better handling tend to beat cars that are made only for straight line speed. But it's not like people can't get a monkey torso from a premium pack, so the underlying implication that's being made, that no one can get a monkey torso, is absolutely false. You can, it just depends on how long it takes (saving tokens, premium pack luck, fortune box luck). I just got the new basalt annihilator from a fortune box. The game isn't stacked against anyone until/unless they get a monkey torso. I am not angry or upset, and I am not trying to be rude or inconsiderate. But if you have the right to keep flogging posts like this where you want to buff torsos, I have an equal right to politely disagree. I mean no one any ill will.

I don't know about that. There's a lot of really powerful Zarkares users at arena ranks 10-12....

Can you please tell us what you actually have first?

I can agree with this. But this should probably have a poll attached (per instructions).

Because I couldn't find a better place. Can we please have an area for scientific or general theory-related discussions? Because I don't want to annoy anyone by posting in the wrong place.........

Not at all. With all due respect, it is called Repulsor because that's its job: it repels (pushes) enemies. I like it the way it is. It's not designed ot do damage, technically, though I imagine it does only because of how this game's programming works. If it was called Advanced Annihilator or Advanced Massacre, sure, it would need a buff or a rename because clearly it isn't very powerful. But its main and only job is to repel enemies. I've used them and I like them for certain applications. Clearly they are useful the way they are because some META use them. I'm sorry you don't agree, but that's simply how I see it. You asked on "META Suggestions," and so that's my suggestion: it's fine the way it is. The only reason (like I already said elsewhere) I'm replying is because you're causing me notifications by quoting me and referencing my name. So I'm replying to defend myself from your false allegations. If you don't want to talk to me, just stop causing me notifications. It's pretty simple. I mean no one any harm. I just don't agree. And with all due respect, honestly, META Suggestion threads are supposed to have polls attached. That would make it easier: I can vote rather than reply. Disagreement is not hatred.