Rework/Buff of old torsos - By LG

[Lord Gorgon]

Observation: In higher ranks, only monkeys are viable, save for a very few situational exceptions of course. That is an issue. That is boring.

İ have been testing EFA, Sabertooth/zarkares quite a bit. Those retain resistance advantage against monkeys. EFA is fine (but very limited in use. Zarkares represents a good sample of old generation torsos. I think that zarkares should have a similar HP to EFA, the latest retaining massive weight advantage. I think all old torsos should receive a similar HP buff, in the neighborhood of 200.

Summary, i propose to add 220hp to all old torsos. Zarkares, windigo, brutality, nightmare/interceptor/sith, grim rapist, naga, vest series etc.

That and the removal of the weight override would bring diversity i believe.

Target here would be to bring diversity in the mechs we can build (and that would retain efficiency), playing with HP, resistances, weights and stats.

Feel free to express your point of views and insights as well as participate the related poll.

Thanks, LG 

Edited December 28, 2020 by Lord Gorgon (see edit history)

[fig]

@Lord Gorgon I agree with the main logic of  the topic to buff old torsos HPs ...
But the number 1 torso than needs to have a buff is Molten Platinum Vest !!!
A buffed hps MPV would really bring a strong competition on the arena towards semi-en-free-phys counters .
Why this torso isnt included ???

[Avrora]

Well. Buff of course needed. But 200 hp difference not gonna play a very big role. It's like 1 more hit.. if adding hp need make them more valuable. Currently no res torsos (monkey series) in only downsite is res, maybe that gonna be logical buff old torsos with some res. Like 10~20 or maybe even 25, because a lot of hp not gonna make difference, but combination of res with ho gonna give enough of survivability without high hp jumps, also allows low rank players have decent resist even with epic Res modules

Edited December 28, 2020 by JustAndromedaInshape (see edit history)

[Lord Gorgon]

35 minutes ago, TALΩS said:

@Lord Gorgon I agree with the main logic of  the topic to buff old torsos HPs ...
But the number 1 torso than needs to have a buff is Molten Platinum Vest !!!
A buffed hps MPV would really bring a strong competition on the arena towards semi-en-free-phys counters .
Why this torso isnt included ???

Read better 

[fig]

Vest right you mentioned it ok great then . Totally agree with that .
Have on mind ...some players uses the night mode ...so black letters on a grey background isnt clear 

[Kurt]

hardened pv needs weight buff imo, stats are ok but overweights

[khan]

5 hours ago, Lord Gorgon said:

Feel free to express your point of views and insights as well as participate the related poll.

I personally feel like the monkey torsos should have an increased weight of atleast 10-20kg or even more because of their massive hp pool, along side with giving the older torsos (From Interceptor all the way to Zarkares) a handfull of 200-250ish hp as mentioned aboe by Gorgon.

Sure this might make "meta" builds even tighter to fit because monkeys will be heavier but it can also open up opportunities for new builds, and make players that climb from lower ranks not regret maxing a bad torso, like Grim reaper, not sayings it bad, but its just way worse in comparison to Zark or any other premium torso. 

Edit: Maybe a system that makes HP lost based on % hp, not 15hp/kg.

Edited December 28, 2020 by Asther
Edit at the bottom (see edit history)

[A Happy F4ce]

<ooooooooo>

Edited December 28, 2020 by Fidelio
seriously lame that posts get like immediately yeeted if you swear (see edit history)

[A Happy F4ce]

I miss windago everyday...

The day windago stopped being viable, a little piece of me died. that was the beginning of the end for me.

#WindagoLivesMatter

also, yah, I was first to do bunker + grim cobra. till then they used to give a grim cobra at epic level every week and nobody wanted it, so I thought Id try make it work. that was some hot shit for a minute there. this was pre-burning shower so it really fricked heat mech's sheett up.

oh, the good old days...

 

EDIT: censored swears since apparently this version of the forum shadow bans your posts if you use bad words...

[Indigo]

8 часов назад лорд Горгон сказал::

Наблюдение: на более высоких уровнях жизнеспособны только обезьяны, за исключением очень немногих ситуационных исключений, конечно. Вот в чем проблема. Это скучно.

Я довольно много тестировал ОДВ, саблезубый/заркарес. Те сохраняют преимущество в сопротивлении против обезьян. ОДВ прекрасна (но очень ограничена в использовании). Заркарес представляет собой хороший образец торсов старого поколения. Я думаю, что заркарес должен иметь такой же HP, как у ОДВ, последний из которых сохраняет огромное преимущество в весе. Я думаю, что все старые торсы должны получить такой же бафф HP, в районе 200.

Резюме: я предлагаю добавить 220 л. с. ко всем старым торсам. Заркарес, Виндиго, жестокость, кошмар/перехватчик/ситх, мрачный насильник, нага, серия жилетов и так далее.

Я думаю, что это и удаление переопределения веса принесло бы разнообразие.

Цель здесь будет заключаться в том, чтобы внести разнообразие в мехи, которые мы можем построить (и которые сохранят эффективность), играя с HP, сопротивлениями, весами и статистикой.

Не стесняйтесь выражать свою точку зрения и идеи, а также участвовать в соответствующем опросе.

Спасибо, LG

I think so too. It is worth improving the old-school torsos and adding variety to the game.But you can also separately mention Hardened Platinum vest it needs a hp buff since other platinum vest torsos are used only for the purpose of obtaining physical protection

[Shoultz262]

Keep in mind that premium items are supposed to be better than regular items. Buffing regular items to be viable in top ranks is good, but they shouldn't be good as or better than premium items. Weight override is fine, don't remove it, but maybe make it cost a bit more, like 20 hp/kg instead of the current 15hp/kg.

[Rovolution]

Give Interceptor a nice buff! Stiff a beautiful torso and the first I maxed in reloaded!

[SawzAll]

22 hours ago, Asther said:

Sure this might make "meta" builds even tighter to fit because monkeys will be heavier but it can also open up opportunities for new builds, and make players that climb from lower ranks not regret maxing a bad torso, like Grim reaper, not sayings it bad, but its just way worse in comparison to Zark or any other premium torso.

No, you can say it.  Grim reaper is not good.  Sure, it's better than a torso that cannot climb to divine tier, sure.  But it's definitely not good.  I jumped one arena rank level just by getting a rusty energy armor in a PP and mything it.

I'm not ashamed to say it: Grim Reaper became food.

---------- REPLY TO MAIN TOPIC ----------

In my opinion, maybe.

But I think instead some torsos that don't go above epic should be instead considered as candidates to become divine without screwing up the meta too much.

Like Anubis.  It looks cool but it don't go past epic.  Rework it so that it is divine-capable and roughly equal to a monkey torso by the time it gets to divine.  This will mean it has less hit points, so let's be honest.

My proposal for an Anubis that now goes to Divine:

365 weight

1530 hit points

356 energy cap

112 regen

200 heat cap

64 cool

22 physical resistance

22 heat resistance

16 electrical resistance

Edited December 29, 2020 by SawzAll (see edit history)

[SawzAll]

@Lord Gorgon I think this is a good idea but I think just adding 220 hp across the board isn't a good solution because some of those old torsos suck more than others.

May I provide a statistically-based guess as to what to buff their hit points to?  Each torso would be slightly different.....

[rc]

On 12/28/2020 at 1:25 AM, Lord Gorgon said:

Target here would be to bring diversity in the mechs we can build

You speak as if there will never be any more torsos. I can guarantee there’ll be more torsos, items, etc. Those new items will be your diversity you speak of. There’s no need to change the stats on those ancient relics when there’ll be new torsos.

Just think of Legacy. It had tons of stuff. I see it being no different with Reloaded.

The day Gato runs out of new items to introduce, it’s time to be worried about Reloaded 2.0 coming than revisions to some old items.

Since Tacticsoft isn’t in business anymore, it just means Gato will take a longer to introduce new items.

[Shoultz262]

6 minutes ago, rc said:

You speak as if there will never be any more torsos. I can guarantee there’ll be more torsos, items, etc. Those new items will be your diversity you speak of. There’s no need to change the stats on those ancient relics when there’ll be new torsos.

Just think of Legacy. It had tons of stuff. I see it being no different with Reloaded.

The day Gato runs out of new items to introduce, it’s time to be worried about Reloaded 2.0 coming than revisions to some old items.

Since Tacticsoft isn’t in business anymore, it just means Gato will take a longer to introduce new items.

There's still like 2 more months until all of the events from Tacticsoft will be done. We'll have to see though.

[epicspeedster]

12 hours ago, SawzAll said:

No, you can say it.  Grim reaper is not good.  Sure, it's better than a torso that cannot climb to divine tier, sure.  But it's definitely not good.  I jumped one arena rank level just by getting a rusty energy armor in a PP and mything it.

I'm not ashamed to say it: Grim Reaper became food.

---------- REPLY TO MAIN TOPIC ----------

In my opinion, maybe.

But I think instead some torsos that don't go above epic should be instead considered as candidates to become divine without screwing up the meta too much.

Like Anubis.  It looks cool but it don't go past epic.  Rework it so that it is divine-capable and roughly equal to a monkey torso by the time it gets to divine.  This will mean it has less hit points, so let's be honest.

My proposal for an Anubis that now goes to Divine:

365 weight

1530 hit points

356 energy cap

112 regen

200 heat cap

64 cool

22 physical resistance

22 heat resistance

16 electrical resistance

this would break the fucking game, everyone without monkeys would use anubis, and anubis is even easiar to get then zarakres

[rc]

Shoultz, I’m not holding my breath. Only time will tell.

[SawzAll]

I hope if there are new torsos they look like skulls.

[rc]

Lordgorgon, I own you a big apology.

I totally forgot Alexander discussed a rebalance of items beyond Frantic Brute. Other than Brute, it didn’t help he didn’t specify what he planned to rebalance. He was so vague; I couldn’t take anything he mentioned seriously until I saw his intentions.

Man, for the first time being on the forum, I’m totally out of touch with current events. I guess it doesn’t help that a lot of the rebalance discussions occurs in Discord with Alexander, or thru other chats not visible on this forum. So, I’m not aware of everything that’s going on with Alexander’s plans.

If you told me a rebalance was in the works, I'd have corrected myself by apologizing to you sooner.

In any case, if I could, I'd offer you a beer at a bar as an apology. Instead, take this emoji beer as an apology. Cheers, Lordgorgon. 

[Androphonia]

On 12/28/2020 at 10:44 AM, Fidelio said:

I miss windago everyday...

The day windago stopped being viable, a little piece of me died. that was the beginning of the end for me.

#WindagoLivesMatter

also, yah, I was first to do bunker + grim cobra. till then they used to give a grim cobra at epic level every week and nobody wanted it, so I thought Id try make it work. that was some hot shit for a minute there. this was pre-burning shower so it really fricked heat mech's sheett up.

oh, the good old days...

 

EDIT: censored swears since apparently this version of the forum shadow bans your posts if you use bad words...

It seems that you've predicted the future, because windigo is now the best f2p torso.

 

Whats my lucky number

[SawzAll]

On 12/29/2020 at 7:44 PM, epicspeedster said:

this would break the fucking game, everyone without monkeys would use anubis, and anubis is even easiar to get then zarakres

I just want more visual options to get the same outcome (see META).  Zarkares hasn't broken the game, and neither have the other torsos (again, see META).  META right now is all monkeys and energy free armor.

But given how the last buff went, I'm sort of against buffing anything any more.