[How did you Start Playing SuperMechs/come across the game?]

I found it through miniclip.

[How did you Start Playing SuperMechs/come across the game?]

Don't you mean playing instead of paying?

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

1 hour ago, Mechzilla said:

I have no plans to use the Desolation unless it’s buffed because it will get me killed and that hurts my team. LG is the most accomplished Desolation/Volcano build player in the history of SM, and he can’t use it at this point. To me, that says a lot.

To delve into this a bit, balance to many items is necessary for the purposes of this balance discussion. Is that not why we are here? Both element and item equilibrium are our goals as I understand them. In order to achieve these goals, many older items will need to be buffed and/or balanced, otherwise they’re simply taking up server space and are useless as players progress. As balance achievement is approached, newer, more powerful or useful items will be released and revenue is generated for Gato Games. That’s called a power creep. Does this make it easier to understand? 

On a personal level, F2P pilots were left behind by TS, and I believe that a meaningful Desolation buff will be a big step in restoring the ability of free players to compete. 

 

 

Power creep is bad for games, even though it brings short term rewards and is quite profitable. And with new and more powerful items being released, the old items will have be buffed again eventually, which defeats the point of creating balance in the first place. The only reason you and lord gorgon don't want to use deso is because it's not meta and quite weak in the current meta of energy free physicals, and you want it to turn into a meta weapon. Deso isn't supposed to be a meta weapon. Meta weapons have to be the best weapons, and it'll usually be premiums.

Also, if deso got buffed, I bet that someone will eventually call for a supreme cannon buff or abomination buff.

That right there, is powercreep. Deso getting a big buff will make supreme cannon more useless than before, because why would you use something that does lower damage but cost energy?

[Uncap the arena store!]

There's no need to make the grind longer. Just no.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

Just now, Nefertary Meriten-Mut said:

The intention of this topic is very good, I adhere to 100 x 100.

However, this weapon was nerfed for a very petty reason that the f2p player didn´t deserve to have a VIP weapon. Mohadib thought it was too good to be an epic weapon.

I wish I had some evidence that the current administration is trying to help the f2p player, but so far I have not.

Before the nerf it has much better heat generation and slightly better damage for 81 heat cost. This buff is a massive buff to deso, it wouldn't be the same as pre nerfed deso, it would be a lot better than it.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

1 minute ago, That1Guy said:

Again, you're acting like this is the only buff. Currently, we're buffing around 5-10 items at a time. Also, heat as a whole doesn't need a buff, but then again, phys definitely doesn't need a buff, and yet I think even you can agree that desert fury does, despite being phys.

I do agree with that, but there should be priorities. Buffing deso or desert fury won't change much right now and could be delayed, while buffing energy will have the greatest effect.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

4 minutes ago, That1Guy said:

Once again, you act like this is the only thing we're going to buff. Energy will get buffed. These things take time. Deso does need a buff though. Unless you have spare weight, which rarely happens in top ranks, deso replaces energy cost with dropping a module or utility, plus, as a damage-based weapon, it's not very good, since it can't actually kill the average top rank mech, which has at least 3.5k HP.

What I don't get is instead of buffing energy weapons right now, which is the weakest element, you want to buff something that'll just make energy worse currently. And heat doesn't really need a buff right now.

How does that make sense?

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

Just now, That1Guy said:

Yes, the range can be solved, but that involves wasting a turn. Yes, I want to make it a meta weapon. I want every weapon to be a meta weapon. And yes, it's en free, but it simply doesn't deal enough damage, statistically, to survive in top ranks. It's also extremely heavy. Apparently, spending 15 weight to make something energy free seems broken to you. Statistically, Spartan uses 31 energy per shot. Assuming you drop a regen booster to make room for deso, you lose at least 65 regen, so it's almost as if it costs 65 energy per shot.

Yes, deso will be broken, especially against energy mechs with low health. And the absence of energy cost allows you to focus more on res and health, which is why most energy free heat mechs are very tanky, except against energy free physical mechs. But go ahead, buff heat when it's still perfectly good with volcano mechs and now heat huggers with swoop, and just leave energy as the worst element. Yes, such a great decision.

And if you say you want every weapon to be meta, why not buff emp or valiant? Or I don't know, hell, even frantics. That's all you want right? Something aren't meant to be meta, what don't you get?

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

Just now, That1Guy said:

That's not what I'm saying about divine. What I'm trying to say is comparing premium to non-premium should be like comparing divine to non-divine. Better, but you don't absolutely need premiums to survive. And no, I don't think deso will be broken. Even though comparing to Spartan is pointless, since they aren't used in the same way, I'll do it anyways. Deso is in a much trickier range to maneuver into(4-8). Most battles occur in ranges 1-4. In addition, even with the new buff, it weighs 15 more than Spartan, which is actually a lot. It also has massive heat cost in exchange for being en free. If we assume that putting Spartan on a mech puts it at exactly 1000kg, Using deso, you would have to drop something, most likely a cooling or regen booster. So essentially, you're losing 65 cooling/regen even without buffs just trying to fit it on, plus, it's also much harder to get in range, typically involving wasting at least one turn using a utility or repulser. The new buff will make it viable and competitive in top ranks, where its damage output just isn't high enough, even though it's a damage-based weapon.

Please, the range can be solved with push weapons like repulser or rollers. The heat cost isn't that high for a energy free weapon. So I was right, you just want to make it into a meta weapon.

And apparently, something like a energy free spartan doesn't seem broken to you.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

15 minutes ago, That1Guy said:

All I'm going to say about this is that our goal in rebalancing items is to make all items viable. I'm avoiding the word meta because a meta is what we're trying to avoid. Deso is not as good as other weapons. True, premiums should be slightly better, but only very slightly. Like, divine boost slightly. Yes, @TALΩS, the proposed buff would give it the same minimum damage as mighty cannon. But mighty cannon is also not nearly as viable as other physical top weapons. JUST BECAUSE ONLY A DESO BUFF WAS PROPOSED HERE DOES NOT MEAN ONLY DESO WILL BE BUFFED.

So let me get this right, you want to make desolation viable in the current meta in simple terms. And if premiums are only better at divine because of the extra boost, what's the point of using them if a divined regular item, which is far more easy to get, is better than a non divined premium, because legy relics are very hard to get. And this is why I don't want a deso buff, because then you'll buff everything else, and so the cycles continues.

@That1Guy So do you think deso will be broken after the buff? About the same damage as spartan and is energy free? It's pretty obvious what the answer is though.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

1 minute ago, Turtle said:

I mean maybe 15% additional damage is not necessary, and you're right, energy still needs all the help it can get.

Exactly, the only thing that deso might need a buff on is a small increase in heat generation so that it's the same as supreme cannon.

 

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

3 minutes ago, Turtle said:

But in my opinion, it wouldn't be as good as Burning Shower still because there's no pull involved with a desolation.

Can you see the stats they want to buff it into? Tell me that about the same damage of spartan and is energy free isn't broken. I don't see how overbuffing an item will bring "balance" into top ranks.

Meanwhile energy is still the worst element, yet they want to buff heat.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

Just now, Turtle said:

Burning Shower has a different purpose than Desolation though.

You don't see anyone using Desolations for their dual Sorrow build, do you? No, because that simply doesn't work as well as having a Burning Shower that pulls enemies closer.

That's not the point though, the point is that premiums are supposed to be better than regular items. Making desolation as good as a premium item isn't right.

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

1 hour ago, Mechzilla said:

Until I see a diverse mix of builds and items in top 10, it is difficult for me to accept that the game is balanced. That’s what we are here for... To help balance items stats so that each user can be competitive, not simply decent. “Decent” can also mean weak when it comes to items, and at least 2/3rds of most players inventories of max myth items are useless. Start counting common, rare, epic and legendary items and the numbers skew exponentially toward unusable items.

Balance.

Being balanced doesn't mean overbuffing an item that doesn't really need a buff to become broken and be as good as premium items. That's not balance. And before long, supreme cannon and abomination will probably get requested for a buff as well because they both do similar damage to desolation. Just no.

Premium items are supposed to be better than regular items. Burning shower is SUPPOSED to be better than desolation.

[DESERT FURY needs a buff ''asap'']

It doesn't need a damage buff, maybe a small damage buff, but what it truly needs is a resist drain buff, probably to 35. This wouldn't make it broken in anyway because of the low damage. It is meant to be a low damage high res drain weapon, kind of like bloodweep since it's the physical counterpart of valiant sniper.

[Repulser needs reduce weight .]

Weight is fine, it's useful as a push weapon, especially for scope builds.

[Savior Resistance vs Iron Plating]

Just now, SawzAll said:

Because I couldn't find a better place.  Can we please have an area for scientific or general theory-related discussions?  Because I don't want to annoy anyone by posting in the wrong place.........

Then it's just part of general discussions, you shouldn't have put it here.

[Savior Resistance vs Iron Plating]

Why is this in clan discussions though? @Alexander Can you move it?

[Desolation rework proposal - by LG]

Desolation is already a decent weapon, I don't really think it needs a buff. Plus, it's not supposed to be as good as premium items like burning shower either. Buffing desolation that much will make it broken, because it's energy free and also does heat damage at the same time, with the explosive damage of spartan carnage. The range isn't a problem if you use a push weapon like repulser or use rollers so I don't see how it would be balanced. Plus, supreme cannon and abomination, which deals similar damage to it currently and isn't energy free, will be completely outclassed. Furthermore, heat is not an issue in top ranks right now, simply because of energy free damage mechs and huggers, now with swoop.

[Where are the 2 push legs and weapons ?]

2 hours ago, TALΩS said:

Guys ....I am talking about serius legs or weapons  
I know all those garbage legs !

with all of those OP range 1-2 weapons plus the huggers ...we NEED two pushing choises !

Just use a hammer then.

[Why people its getting banned?]

On 1/8/2021 at 12:06 PM, MasterChief said:

quick question. what is the patch? what did it do?

Basically, lucky patcher allows you to make in app purchases without actually losing money.

[What do you guys think of this build? It's mainly consisting of items I either have already, or shouldn't be too hard to get.]

Replace 2 armor platings for energy engines, your energy is pretty bad. Also, use tonto because your mech has low health and tonto synergize better. You can get rank 5, yeah, but not any higher unless you get better items or is lucky.

[Where are the 2 push legs and weapons ?]

And recoilers already do push and recoil. We don't really need 2 push shotguns.

[Arena chat battle invite bug]

1 hour ago, Electrick010 said:

At the moment I do not know if they are solved, but I advise you that when updating, you send a request to a lower rank or do some figth in the sand, I also suffered and curiously it only works at those ranks, or do thator do the fight, I don't guarantee it either, (so you can send a request to another player with a higher rank), they will fix it soon, (I want to think about that).

This is just a picture to show, this problem still applies when I send a battle invite to a higher rank.

[Buff disintegration .]

Disintegration isn't a bad weapon, it has better damage and is lighter than annihilation in exchange for a bit of backfire, plus it's energy free. But yes, it might need a small buff, not a big one.