Remove Hybid Cannons

[CDR_Xavier]

For the sake of balancing.

Stats

HOT FLASH (66) 3-6 R 148-228 D 142 E -24 MaxEn (0/110)
HYBRID E.CANNON*(66) 3-6 R 156-269 D 139 E -39 MaxEn (0/104)

FLAMINATOR (47) 3-6 R 148-228 D 93 H -24 MxHt (110/0)
HYBRID HEAT CANNON*(47) 3-6 R 159-269 D 105 H -33 MxHt (104/0)

And both hybrid had been buffed too.

You are NOT ALLOWED to have OVERALL BETTER STATS, just because it's some "PREMIUM" counterpart of otherwise totally competitive (and balanced) objects

These two items are inherently broken. If you say it's not broken then the game itself is broken. There are no equivalent counterparts of any other weapon that offers better performance across the board on the same tier, premium or non-premium alike.

Especially since they both go to myth (and, by extension, divine).

They are the same type, weigh less, cost less energy/heat to run, and deal more damage across the board.

Either change them to range 4 - 8 top weapons, or replace them with their R-D variants.

Edited December 23, 2020 by CDR_Xavier
fixed content (see edit history)

[Alexander]

I'll allow the topic but please keep in mind we will probably never consider removing a released item.

[CDR_Xavier]

2 minutes ago, Alexander said:

removing

Huh.

Had you considered repurposing them as top weapons instead?

Since top weapons generally hit harder

[Jiyoon]

33 minutes ago, CDR_Xavier said:

You are NOT ALLOWED to have OVERALL BETTER STATS, just because it's some "PREMIUM" counterpart of otherwise totally competitive (and balanced) objects

But why are you only taking about the hybrid cannons, not annihilation and disintegration, charge engine and superb charge engine, even single modules and l-m combined modules? Their l-m counterparts were much stronger than e-m counterpart, a lot far from e-m and l-m hybrid cannon.

39 minutes ago, CDR_Xavier said:

These two items are inherently broken.

I don't think hybrid cannon's were broken, I saw they were completely outdated, as I seen on top ranks.

Energy hybrid cannon's were overweighted, 66kg is way too heary for an energy weapon with that much heat cost, even energy itself was the weakest element, you only need to equip heat modules on physical and heat nowadays, for a rounded build. But for energy, you need to equip both energy and heat modules, that's a lots of kg. Also most weapon's energy counterpart were heavier than their physical and heat counterparts. 

You would have overweight difficulties if you tried to build a rounded energy mech with hybrid cannons.

Heat hybrid cannons were absolutely useless in arena, since meta heat builds nowadays require high damage and high hp, with that much energy cost, you need to equip energy modules, which will affect the overall hp badly.

I see both hybrid cannons doesn't need nerf at all, they need buff instead, removing them from the game is totally nonsence.

If you really want to nerf them, Why not nerf the other items I mentioned before? Since they were way more broken than hybrid cannons.

[WarrMachine]

1 hour ago, CDR_Xavier said:

You are NOT ALLOWED to have OVERALL BETTER STATS, just because it's some "PREMIUM" counterpart of otherwise totally competitive (and balanced) objects

This is the entire point, you pay, you get objectively better items. SuperMechs is not an esport, it's a pay to win flash game. 

+1 to everything jiyoon said. Take one look at top player replays and tell me if HHC and HEC are broken in any way. Spoiler alert, they're both trash in this meta.

[CDR_Xavier]

1 hour ago, Jiyoon said:

annihilation

Because annihilation is E-M, and is a direct upgrade to the C-R boomwich.

The reason annihilation is not broken is because at EPIC TIER, it do not compete with any other item with similar damage (other than homage, which have similar damage). It is better than other weapons in some ways (e.g. 0 cost) but inferior in others (e.g. damage, range, weight)

the reason boomwich is not broken is because at RARE TIER, it do not compete with any other item with similar damage, nor does it excel them in any way.

The reason hybid energy cannon is broken is because at LEGENDARY TIER, it DIRECTLY competes with hot flash and outperforms it in EVERY SINGLE ASPECT. There is no other item in the game that does this, beside its heat counterpart, hybid heat cannon.

34 minutes ago, WarrMachine said:

This is the entire point, you pay, you get objectively better items

Not a objectively better item that competes directly with another weapon with identical function, range, and (lower), purpose and damage

unless there is lower tier versions of hybid cannons (which will form a competing line against hot flash), which renders hot flash obsolete

1 hour ago, Jiyoon said:

I saw they were completely outdated

They are outdated, but they are broken. At least, when compared to hot flash and flaminator

The reason they are "outdated" is because they are too expensive -- 106 eng cost and heat cost respectively.

The other reason I say "remove it" is because nobody uses it (and very few have it)

1 hour ago, Jiyoon said:

they need buff instead

then buff hot flash and flaminator.

1 hour ago, Jiyoon said:

superb charge engine

superb charge is broken and should be removed. It directly compete with charge engine.

1 hour ago, Jiyoon said:

l-m combined modules

They are, too. They offered way better stat.

The whole point in paying (in such a game) is not to gain a absolute "unfair" advantage, but to acquire items more quickly and max them eventually. A balanced game should not "remove accessibility" to any single item and/or render a version that's non-premium less useful than the one that is, just like how premium tanks in World of Tanks isn't going to be absolutely better than regular credit-purchased tanks.

They do earn 50% more credits, and experience, which can be earned by performing actions (e.g. dealing damage to opponents) in battles.

However, premium items with unique abilities (as in, distance controller, for example; energy free armor, for example; distance shredder; mighty cannon; spinefall; dustmaker) can be added as wish, as long as their performance isn't absolutely better than any other item.

But the hybrid cannons, in every sense, IS absolutely better than another item. So it shall be removed, nerfed, or repurposed.

Edited December 23, 2020 by CDR_Xavier (see edit history)

[WarrMachine]

2 hours ago, CDR_Xavier said:

Not a objectively better item that competes directly with another weapon with identical function, range, and (lower), purpose and damage

unless there is lower tier versions of hybid cannons (which will form a competing line against hot flash), which renders hot flash obsolete

No, like that's the point of pay to win games. That's how they keep the servers up and pay the staff. There needs to be objectively better versions of "free" items to give players incentive to spend money.

[CDR_Xavier]

8 minutes ago, WarrMachine said:

There needs to be objectively better versions of "free" items to give players incentive to spend money.

Depend on how many player there is, this may or may not be necessary.

[CleverName]

imo, L-M items should always be better than E-M items, in every way possible or at least in the important ways. 

I think a good indicator of what needs balance is usage in tops ranks. All of these 4 weapons are barely used, so if anything, I'd recommend a buff. 

[nas-1]

lmao

[CDR_Xavier]

1 hour ago, CleverName said:

All of these 4 weapons are barely used, so if anything, I'd recommend a buff. 

You also need to put in the consideration that a buff to these items can give rise to some intensely headache builds (e.g. energy free energy)

But since they are not used (in general) as frequent, a buff can be done.

[Lookotza]

6 hours ago, CDR_Xavier said:

The other reason I say "remove it" is because nobody uses it (and very few have it)

So just screw everyone who has them right?