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why hasnt frantic been nerfed?


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On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

Good thing it's up to Alex and not you.

Yes, that’s a good thing. You wouldn’t like it if I were in charge.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

Making it only rank 1-2 means his team would not have diverse opinions.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But that's another beautiful thing about the balance team.  We don't have to agree.  We have different perspectives.  Diversity is strength.  But I listen to the rank 1-2's when they talk, and I value their knowledge.

Diverse opinions aren’t the same as good opinions, such as your opinion about countering Brute:

On 4/24/2021 at 8:03 AM, SawzAll said:

And the way to counter them is still to stay out of frantic range.

I seriously can’t believe you mentioned that.

Anyway, I see what you’re saying about diverse opinions. A low-rank’s opinions on a low tier item would make sense. But there’s something you’re forgetting. Rank 1-2 were once rank 25. Just because people attain rank 1-2 doesn’t mean they forgot about their roots.

But sure, diverse opinions as you say. I see nothing wrong with a low-rank’s opinions for lower tier items, as long as it’s sensible opinions. Despite saying that, I still think rank 1-2 opinions matter more.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But seeing that I made rank 3 with 3 stars this week, I don't think it's that important that I be rank 1-2.

My point is about knowledge and experience. If you don’t have one or the other, you don’t have the whole picture. With that said, it makes sense people who possess these characteristics will be those in the higher ranks, not some rank 25.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But seeing that I made rank 3 with 3 stars this week

I disagree. Rank 1-2 is leagues beyond rank 3. I’ll use an exaggerated example: Rank 1 vs. rank 25. My point is rank 3 doesn’t possess the knowledge and experience to attain rank 1; discounting copying someone else’s builds.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

What you don't notice, because you're not on the team, is that I'm willing to learn, and that I never assume I know everything about the game.

Good to hear. I look forward to seeing you improve on your logic very soon then.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But from my perspective (had to make sure you see that before you reply), frantic brute is still powerful enough that it can ruin everyone's day, except those in rank 1-2, who are probably in rank 1-2 because they have 3 x fortresses and platinums, etc.  But hey, I could be wrong.

That’s incorrect. I don’t have to be rank 1-2 to trash Brute users. I can do it in rank 5!

That’s interesting to note you’re picking on Brute only and not Spartan. Let me guess, you think Brute is better than Spartan?

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

If dual divine frantic can end anyone in 2 turns except people in rank 1-2, and it's not even a premium, in my opinion it's overpowered.

If Brute kills you in 2 turns, then you aren’t good. With you saying that, why don’t you get good before thinking about nerfing something. It sounds like you set yourself up for failure against Brute.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But I can also go on WU and test it for myself.  In WU, the only thing that usually beats dual frantic + claw builds is a build from CleverName's meta listing.  Sure, it's "just WU," but still, I think it's worth pointing out.

With you saying that, it makes absolute sense that you struggle with Brute. Why don’t you think about your own builds instead of copying someone else’s build. That way, you can think for yourself instead of spoon-fed build strategies.

On 4/24/2021 at 5:27 PM, SawzAll said:

But I can also go on WU and test it for myself.

And by the way, you saying that is the same thing as the Spiderman meme or playing chess against yourself.

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Edited by rc (see edit history)
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16 minutes ago, rc said:

Diverse opinions aren’t the same as good opinions, such as your opinion about countering Brute

That was directly from a rank 1 player on the balance team in a discussion we had on discord.  Don't like it?  Go on there and argue it with them, not me.  And besides which, using methods to keep them from firing both frantics in one turn still cuts down on the damage and still works for me.  (The other idea they suggested was have 170+ phys res.)

 

20 minutes ago, rc said:

you saying that is the same thing as the Spiderman meme or playing chess against yourself.

Maybe, but it's the best we have for that.  What, do you think everyone has two divine frantics and a divine claw lying around?

WU isn't perfect, but it's a lot better than just a random opinion.

18 minutes ago, rc said:

I disagree. Rank 1-2 is leagues beyond rank 3

What does that have to do with frantic brute?

19 minutes ago, rc said:

That’s interesting to note you’re picking on Brute only and not Spartan. Let me guess, you think Brute is better than Spartan?

I haven't thought that Frantic > Spartan for a while now.  I thought that Frantic was far too powerful for a non-premium compared to a premium like spartan carnage.

But you seem oddly quick to discount the many users who have complained about frantic, which does include some rank 1-2's (if you read through the history on this forum I'm sure you'll find them).

So let me ask you: what does all of your reply, where you try to make this more about me than about the actual subject, have to do with Frantic?  Really nothing.  The balance team has been mostly rank 1's since it was created.  Do you seriously think the opinion of a rank 5 is going to override like five rank 1 players?  Heck no.

Which is what makes this attempt of ad hominem even more funny: I could be the most charismatic rank 5 in the universe and my opinion would never override that of the rank 1 players on the balance team.  I'm on the team not just for experience, but perspective.

But if you disagree with me being on the team, shoot an email to Alexander.  Otherwise I'm just assuming this is jealousy or something.

I don't think I'm someone special just because I'm on the balance team.

So back to the topic: how does any of that change how Frantic is rather OP for a non-premium?

"Play stupid games, win stupid prizes."

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Posted (edited)
On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

That was directly from a rank 1 player on the balance team in a discussion we had on discord.

What exactly did this rank-1 player say? And who mentioned this?

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

And besides which, using methods to keep them from firing both frantics in one turn still cuts down on the damage and still works for me.

What methods are you referring to?

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

WU isn't perfect, but it's a lot better than just a random opinion.

I give you credit for trying in WU, but that’s not the same as playing against other players.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

What does that have to do with frantic brute?

On 5/3/2021 at 7:55 AM, rc said:

I disagree. Rank 1-2 is leagues beyond rank 3.

If I’m not mistaken, you’re referring to my quoted comment above. If that’s the case, you quoted a single sentence out of context.

You forgot to quote my entire paragraph.

On 5/3/2021 at 7:55 AM, rc said:

I disagree. Rank 1-2 is leagues beyond rank 3. I’ll use an exaggerated example: Rank 1 vs. rank 25. My point is rank 3 doesn’t possess the knowledge and experience to attain rank 1; discounting copying someone else’s builds.

You need to read the entire paragraph to get what I’m discussing.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

Go on there and argue it with them, not me.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

I don't think I'm someone special just because I'm on the balance team

Because you’re on the Balance Team, that’s even more reason to debate this issue with you.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

The balance team has been mostly rank 1's since it was created.  Do you seriously think the opinion of a rank 5 is going to override like five rank 1 players?  Heck no.

I’m glad to hear that because rank-1 players should have more leeway due to their experience.

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Sigh... Whenever I’ve a debate with you, why do you always have to take it personally? Can it ever be straight on the subject matter, which is about Brute.

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Once again, if you actually read everything I mentioned, you’d have a clue what I’m discussing. I’m talking about Brute! It isn’t about you. If I were actually talking about you only, I wouldn’t bother having a debate on Brute.

Can you stop making this debate about you? I can do without further off-topic comments.

In regards to ad hominem, let me guess, the following comments we had is what you’re referring to as ad hominem?

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On 5/3/2021 at 7:55 AM, rc said:

If Brute kills you in 2 turns, then you aren’t good. With you saying that, why don’t you get good before thinking about nerfing something. It sounds like you set yourself up for failure against Brute.

1.PNG.06b236468ed0e9150e6048510c7291dd.PNG

On 5/3/2021 at 7:55 AM, rc said:

With you saying that, it makes absolute sense that you struggle with Brute. Why don’t you think about your own builds instead of copying someone else’s build. That way, you can think for yourself instead of spoon-fed build strategies.

I criticized your logic on Brute, not your character. If I criticized your character, then you can consider that ad hominem. I suggest you look up the meaning of ad hominem.

Let me guess. Since you’re unable to defeat Brute, you want to nerf it, so you can benefit from its nerf. If that’s the case, that shows how bias you are. I’ll reiterate myself again: get good before discussing a nerf. Otherwise, you’ve no basis on discussing a nerf.

Since Tacticsoft didn’t see a reason to nerf it, despite repeated requests for a nerf, I don’t see a reason to nerf it in the first place either. After all, Tacticsoft is the creator of this game, and they had a team of programmers to ensure there’s balance in their game. It was in their best interest to maintain a balance.

Besides, Alexander already had it nerfed. How many times does it need to be nerfed? Nerf it into non-existent?

1.PNG.06b236468ed0e9150e6048510c7291dd.PNG

By the way, I don’t need to use CleverName’s builds to beat Brutes. I simply use dual Spartans, as you should already know by now. So, once again, you’re incorrect because you limit yourself by copying someone else’s build instead of strategically thinking of your own build.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

But if you disagree with me being on the team, shoot an email to Alexander.  Otherwise I'm just assuming this is jealousy or something.

Lol, jealousy is the furthest thing from my mind. That reminds me of the last debate we had about Brute. You thought I was thinking about something when it was never on the radar for me.

As you can see, the further I reply to your comments, the further it strays from the topic of discussion, Brute!

Can we drop the off-topic ad hominem and Balance Team comments, and get back to the subject matter? Thank you!

Frankly, I’m been done on the Balance Team comments since I mentioned it in my first post. I’m not interested in hearing you defend your position on it. As far as I’m concerned, you’re on the Balance Team. That should be end of that discussion.

On 5/3/2021 at 8:21 AM, SawzAll said:

So back to the topic: how does any of that change how Frantic is rather OP for a non-premium?

Finally, back on topic!

I disagree. Brute isn’t op for a non-premium. From my experience since Alexander’s nerf on Brute, I noticed these performances on Brute in the arena:

  • In general, Brute does a little less damage than a Spartan does. So, it shouldn’t be a problem for dual Spartans to take down dual Brutes.
  •  
  • As for Heat builds, if people have the right builds, they can destroy Spartans or Brutes in the top ranks, especially since heat have equivalent HP as physical and can cause shutdowns.
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  • Lastly, for energy builds, people shouldn’t have an issue with Brute since its energy requirement has increased due to Alexander’s nerf. The same goes for Brute’s heat requirement increased. Therefore, it’s still possible to drain opponents (Brute users).

With everything just mentioned, it seems at the middle ranks everything is equal. Otherwise, why would I still see all 3 elements in the area.

If people want to complain, then get good. What it really comes down to is how people strategically build their mechs.

If anything, people can counter a Brute with another Brute. That’s a simply strategy. Everyone has easy access to Brutes since it’s a non-premium item. It’s not like getting a Spartan.  

Edited by rc (see edit history)
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hmm, tempting. maybe I should make some. 🤗

image.png.52a907141f9bc089584ecaab21d5ce7a.png

18 minutes ago, OKI DOKI said:

hmm, tempting. maybe I should make some. 🤗

image.png.52a907141f9bc089584ecaab21d5ce7a.png

that black baby it is my original frantic from my first mech. Yep. guilty of charge of rookie frantic user not having anything else available so mix was the solution. 🙂 

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